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http://crealm.libsyn.com/252-your-christmas-pony-paleo-or-high-tech-

KMO talks with Lierre Keith and Tara Holste about agriculture and the civilizations to which it gives rise. Lierre argues that vegetarianism, no matter the motivation, destroys the Earth as readily as does a diet heavy with meat so long as it depends on annual mono-cropping. Her expression of this opinion has drawn scorn and physical assaults from vegan ideologues. Lierre wants humans to return to a pre-agricultural existence, and she does not admit of any possibility of moving beyond civilization into something sustainable yet distinct from the paleolithic mode of human existence.

Music by Fernando Tarango

A listener sent this link to the work of Thomas Linzey, the anti corporation lawyer Lierre mentioned in the episode. He has written Be the Change and has apparently appeared at the Bioneers Conference. E F. Schumaker Lecture:

http://www.smallisbeautiful.org/publications/linzey_06.html

Before the interview I read a short excerpt from this blog post by Kevin Kelly:

http://www.kk.org/thetechnium/archives/2011/03/radical_optimis.php

Be sure to check out the comments.

Comments

( 4 comments — Leave a comment )
pacman7331
Apr. 8th, 2011 07:46 pm (UTC)
Excuse Me, What Patriarchy?
Lierre Keith, interviewed on episode 252 had allot of information but I found her understanding somewhat confining and followed by some uncompromising sweeping judgements, such as agriculture being a war against nature. Finally she comes to mention that the cause of all problems is "The Patriarchy". I find it offensive that she goes on to make women and children as victims while she insinuates and singles out men as the perpetrators and guilty. Thats when I decided I had to write in, and perhaps she would respond to this? (note comment is in two pieces as livejournal limits length)

Excuse Me, What Patriarchy?

• Men and Fathers face the harshest discrimination in family courts. [17] [18]
• Epidemic of false accusations are near half of all rape cases. False accusations on men from sexual harassment to rape to child molestation. [12] [13]
• Violence Against Women Act profiles men and demands that they be arrested in all domestic violence disputes. [11]
• 4 out of 5 Suicides are male (18 out of 23 more accurately) [10]
• Misandry and abuse and denigration of men is widespread across media, while at the same time media is extra sensitive to stay up to date with each and every feminist demand for favorable and correct portrayal of women in media. [23] [24] [25] [26] [27]
• College enrollment and gradation of males is declining and has been for decades. [5] [4] [3]
• Male fertility has been on the decline for at least a century. [8]
• No men's shelters. [10]
• Men have no reproductive rights and are often victims of paternity fraud. [15] [16]
• Most homeless people are men. [14]
• Men's unemployment rate is 3 times as high as female. [17]
• 80% of wealth is spent by women [10]
• Women handle 75 percent of family finances. 43 percent of those with assets over $500,000 are women. [10]
• 99% of combats deaths are male [10]
• 94% of industrial deaths male [10]
• 76% of homicides are male [10]
• Women receive custody in 84% of child custody cases. [10]
• 204 out of 205 people wrongly convicted exonerated by DNA (evidence have been men (via the innocence project) . [10]
• In America there are over 270 women's commissions but only one for men in New Hampshire. [10]
• There are over 700 women studies programs in colleges and universities but but no one teaching mens or male studies from a masculinist perspective. [10]
• Men are over half the victims of domestic violence but in over 90% of domestic violence disputes men are the ones arrested. [19] [11]
• Breast cancer funding is a national icon of funding but Prostate cancer is totally ignored while the death rates are roughly equal. [10]
• The wage gap now favor's women in their twenties. [20]
• Men die 5 years earlier than women but no compensation is made to them for this via social security or otherwise. [10]
• A entire branch of the UN is dedicated to women, nothing for men. [1]
• There is much discussion on the status of women in society, none for men. [22]
• There are billions of dollars of tax money going into women's issues and none for men. [21] [22]
• There are branches of US Federal government dedicated to the interests of women such as health, but none for men. [2]
• Masculinity and male emotions are hardly tolerated in society.
• Global society is becoming more and more gynocentric.
• Gender warfare rages on with hardly any participation of men.
• Men are blamed for all social and world problems
• Most of civilization is but a shopping mall for women to go shopping.
pacman7331
Apr. 8th, 2011 07:47 pm (UTC)
Excuse Me, What Patriarchy? Part 2.

"The days where men were in charge and had all the power, is nothing more than a feminist fantasy concocted to excuse finger pointing at the entire male sex, justifying their own identity as victims and ironically enough their own pursuit of a lopsided power arrangement. Sure there has historically been the upper 2% of men who had allot of power and control, but as far as male power goes, thats where it ended. The other 98% of men were never powerful, never! Just the opposite in fact, they led powerless lives of sacrifice and expendability in order to take care of women and children and to serve the interest of the 2% of men that feminists always complain about, and very mistakenly confused for the way the rest of men actually lived. And that upper 2% held much more oppressive sway over the rest of men than they did women. It was the 98% of men who were conscripted to fight in the wars forced to take on the shitty back breaking jobs and did so generally with mouths closed and heads down so as not to jeopardize their ability to take care of their families. The idea that there was ever any privilege or power in that is so stupid it borders on deranged! But that is what feminists have convinced themselves of and allot of other people as well. " - Paul Elam from A Voice For Men Radio Episode 1 (March 2nd 2011) [9]


Sources:

[1] http://www.unwomen.org/

[2] http://www.womenshealth.gov/

[3] http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/31/60minutes/main527678.shtml

[4] http://www.economics.harvard.edu/faculty/goldin/files/homecoming.pdf

[5] http://education-portal.com/articles/Leaving_Men_Behind:_Women_Go_to_College_in_Ever-Greater_Numbers.html

[6] http://www.mediaradar.org/research_on_false_rape_allegations.php

[7] http://www.tigweb.org/youth-media/panorama/article.html?ContentID=4309&start=

[8] http://www.sustainer.org/dhm_archive/index.php?display_article=vn630spermed

[9] http://www.blogtalkradio.com/avoiceformen

[10] http://standyourground.com/forums/index.php?PHPSESSID=4d7b9a846df1381b1402ccd744c9727f&topic=16416.0

[11] http://www.newswithviews.com/guest_opinion/guest68.htm

[12] http://www.falserape.net/false-rape.htm

[13] http://www.mediaradar.org/research_on_false_rape_allegations.php

[14] http://www.nationalhomeless.org/factsheets/who.html

[15] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reproductive_rights

[16] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paternity_fraud

[17] http://www.coeffic.demon.co.uk/descrim.htm

[18] http://www.rightsandwrongs.co.uk/asia/other/3873-men-family-courts-discrimination-against-men-for-being-men

[19] http://pn.psychiatryonline.org/content/42/15/31.2.full

[20] http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/women-in-their-twenties-smash-glass-ceiling-to-reverse-pay-gap-2154836.html

[21] http://www.thepriceofliberty.org/05/08/19/guest_mark.htm

[22] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidential_Commission_on_the_Status_of_Women

[23] http://www.ejfi.org/family/family-77.htm

[24] http://www.pellebilling.com/2009/04/misandry-in-the-media/

[25] http://www.fathersandhusbands.org/

[26] http://www.media4women.com/

[27] http://www.womensmediacenter.com/
solarbobky
Apr. 11th, 2011 02:23 pm (UTC)
How do we get there?
So what is the strategy to get there? Chestnut and hazelnut forests?
http://www.badgersett.com/
Is pastoralism better than agriculture? How many can it support? Gathering and hunting?
Is there time to get the population there without a die off? (Doubtful)
What about pasture cropping?
http://agroinnovations.com/index.php/en_us/multimedia/blogs/2010/07/episode-98-pasture-cropping/
http://www.pasturecropping.com/
Perennial polyculture?
http://www.landinstitute.org/
Does Lierre have buffalo in her backyard? Is she digging Apios americana tubers?
peristaltor
Apr. 21st, 2011 07:46 pm (UTC)
I must concur with the other commenters. This interview-ee has a mildly interesting message completely obscured by a complete inability to convey that message without expressing unnecessary contempt, revulsion, outrage, etc, all wrapped in unbelievable hyperbole and dismissive derision.

She literally made me want to clearcut an old-growth forest and plant Monsanto franken-corn just to piss her off, and -- more importantly! -- to show everyone else that I have nothing in common with her.

Ms. Keith does a disservice to every concept with which she might find worthy of attention and support. If she used the same presentation stylings displayed in KMO's interview to describe a cure for cancer, I suspect most people would choose to die a horrible and painful death.
( 4 comments — Leave a comment )

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